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Re: Southampton

Postby AD » Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:20 am

the boss wrote:I said a few years back we should get a manager and stick with him for 4/5 no matter what, build slow with kids. Got shot down (again), some said what would we do if the manager looked like he was taking us down? Well guess what, sacking after sacking has taken us down 8)


Really?

So we got relegated from the Prem because we sacked Strachan did we? A man who had been at the helm 5 years and at the club about 7?And we got relegated this year because we sacked Thorn?

Whereas sacking the likes of Reid, Adams, Dowie and Boothroyd led to relegation those years didn't it :?
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Re: Southampton

Postby the boss » Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:34 am

AD wrote:
the boss wrote:I said a few years back we should get a manager and stick with him for 4/5 no matter what, build slow with kids. Got shot down (again), some said what would we do if the manager looked like he was taking us down? Well guess what, sacking after sacking has taken us down 8)


Really?

So we got relegated from the Prem because we sacked Strachan did we? A man who had been at the helm 5 years and at the club about 7?And we got relegated this year because we sacked Thorn?

Whereas sacking the likes of Reid, Adams, Dowie and Boothroyd led to relegation those years didn't it :?



then and now are different times. We had money spent on big signing which failed. So its right someone should pay, as you said he had five years so it was plain to see he was not the man. Now we don't have any cash we need to build from a very young age and that takes time, unless you have a magic wand :roll: Yes we can keep sacking man after man and one day we might just get the 2nd coming of Jesus or then again we might just be worse off. I'd rather try and build than keep hoping a miracle wil happen.
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Re: Southampton

Postby plastic scouser » Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:53 am

...which is precisely the opposite to what you said earlier this very season, only about 4 months ago, when you stated that thorn should go.....

The financial situation has been dire since Thorns appointment......

....It has not changed.....unlike boss who has done a complete about turn.
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Re: Southampton

Postby the boss » Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:01 pm

plastic scouser wrote:...which is precisely the opposite to what you said earlier this very season, only about 4 months ago, when you stated that thorn should go.....

The financial situation has been dire since Thorns appointment......

....It has not changed.....unlike boss who has done a complete about turn.



Yes, but as I said before, just because I said it, that does not mean its right :lol: It still does not change the point, the decision should be made to appoint the manager and let him manage for 5 years, bring kids on and teach them to play without fear. Not knowing if the manager will be there tomorrow won't help this will it :roll:
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Re: Southampton

Postby adge » Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:14 pm

You lot will be waiting a long time in your arm chairs growing old for any manager to "bring the kids on". I keep hearing this "good set of kids" non-sence and it is now getting boring. Good luck in waiting for Conor Thomas to be the next Paul Scholes-trust me you will be waiting a long time. They are not good enough and never will be. If Thomas was good enough he would still be at Liverpool-why do you think he is back here? Wake up and smell the coffee.
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Re: Southampton

Postby dog rout 21 » Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:26 pm

Quite right adge, no one outside of the prem will ever improve and be good enough to play in the prem no matter their age.
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Re: Southampton

Postby AD » Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:27 pm

the boss wrote:
AD wrote:
the boss wrote:I said a few years back we should get a manager and stick with him for 4/5 no matter what, build slow with kids. Got shot down (again), some said what would we do if the manager looked like he was taking us down? Well guess what, sacking after sacking has taken us down 8)


Really?

So we got relegated from the Prem because we sacked Strachan did we? A man who had been at the helm 5 years and at the club about 7?And we got relegated this year because we sacked Thorn?

Whereas sacking the likes of Reid, Adams, Dowie and Boothroyd led to relegation those years didn't it :?



then and now are different times. We had money spent on big signing which failed. So its right someone should pay, as you said he had five years so it was plain to see he was not the man. Now we don't have any cash we need to build from a very young age and that takes time, unless you have a magic wand :roll: Yes we can keep sacking man after man and one day we might just get the 2nd coming of Jesus or then again we might just be worse off. I'd rather try and build than keep hoping a miracle wil happen.


So what happens if we give someone all the money to spend and five years and then realise he's the wrong guy too? Time and money down the shitter. Whereas in that time the right person may have become available but you turned down the chance so as to stick with a choice that didn't seem to be working but apparently time will automatically fix this. What you are talking about is hindsight which we don't have the luxury of in the present. I'd rather get through loads of managers and hopefully eventually find the right one that fits than just stick blindly with something that isn't working.

If you had a business that was doing poorly would you keep the person you'd hired to run it and give them more money, or let someone else have a go before it got really bad?
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Re: Southampton

Postby haggis » Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:27 pm

adge wrote:You lot will be waiting a long time in your arm chairs growing old for any manager to "bring the kids on". I keep hearing this "good set of kids" non-sence and it is now getting boring. Good luck in waiting for Conor Thomas to be the next Paul Scholes-trust me you will be waiting a long time. They are not good enough and never will be. If Thomas was good enough he would still be at Liverpool-why do you think he is back here? Wake up and smell the coffee.


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Southampton

Postby Realist » Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:31 pm

the boss wrote:
Realist wrote:My mate bet me 5€ it would be 6-0 at the time we were 4-0 down. Even I was surprised it didn't happen, I took the bet because I thought Saints would hit 7.


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Re: Southampton

Postby the boss » Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:47 pm

AD wrote:
the boss wrote:

So what happens if we give someone all the money to spend and five years and then realise he's the wrong guy too? ?



:lol: :lol: :lol: Spend :lol: :lol: We have'nt got a pot to piss in which if you'd paid attention you'd see thats what I've been beating on about :roll: Boy, I'm even boring myself now :lol:
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Re: Southampton

Postby the boss » Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:52 pm

AD wrote:

If you had a business that was doing poorly would you keep the person you'd hired to run it and give them more money, or let someone else have a go before it got really bad?



Got really bad :lol: :lol: Did you miss the past 10 seasons :lol:
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Re: Southampton

Postby AD » Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:08 pm

the boss wrote:
AD wrote:
the boss wrote:

So what happens if we give someone all the money to spend and five years and then realise he's the wrong guy too? ?



:lol: :lol: :lol: Spend :lol: :lol: We have'nt got a pot to piss in which if you'd paid attention you'd see thats what I've been beating on about :roll: Boy, I'm even boring myself now :lol:


Hypothetical!

So we haven't got a pot to piss in,and Thorn has failed with those circumstances. So lets keep him, under those circumstances, and things will improve. For no other reason than he's got more time. :roll:
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Re: Southampton

Postby the boss » Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:17 pm

AD wrote:
the boss wrote:
AD wrote:
the boss wrote:

So what happens if we give someone all the money to spend and five years and then realise he's the wrong guy too? ?



:lol: :lol: :lol: Spend :lol: :lol: We have'nt got a pot to piss in which if you'd paid attention you'd see thats what I've been beating on about :roll: Boy, I'm even boring myself now :lol:


Hypothetical!

So we haven't got a pot to piss in,and Thorn has failed with those circumstances. So lets keep him, under those circumstances, and things will improve. For no other reason than he's got more time. :roll:



one thing is certain, if we don't give the man time we will never know. Not that I think Thorn is the greatest since old big head but sooner or later someone has to have time to build. Then again I heard Pep was seen in Tesco's at the Ricoh this morning :roll:
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Re: Southampton

Postby AD » Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:21 pm

the boss wrote:
AD wrote:

If you had a business that was doing poorly would you keep the person you'd hired to run it and give them more money, or let someone else have a go before it got really bad?



Got really bad :lol: :lol: Did you miss the past 10 seasons :lol:


So where do you think we'd be now had we kept Strachan and not changed manager at all? If something isn't working you change it. Other managers since didn't seem to be working either, so we changed. And we stayed up. This year, either through lack of funds or whatever, we didn't twist and we went down. I'd say the mistakes we've made are 1. Interfering with Nilsson bringing in Jim Smith 2. Sacking Black when he was still doing a reasonable job for a 'big name'.

I'm not a Mandaric type who would sack someone for losing two games on the trot or not getting to the play-offs. I'd be happy to settle for a few years mid-table as long as the building for the future could be seen, as Southampton showed with the likes of Bale, Walcott, Chamberlain and Lallana. But you have to put some emphasis on the here and now too, or all those long term plans can be ruined.

If Thorn starts L1 like Strachan started the Championship or whatever it was called then do you think you'll keep the stick with him mantra?
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Re: Southampton

Postby AD » Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:24 pm

the boss wrote:
AD wrote:
the boss wrote:
AD wrote:
the boss wrote:

So what happens if we give someone all the money to spend and five years and then realise he's the wrong guy too? ?



:lol: :lol: :lol: Spend :lol: :lol: We have'nt got a pot to piss in which if you'd paid attention you'd see thats what I've been beating on about :roll: Boy, I'm even boring myself now :lol:


Hypothetical!

So we haven't got a pot to piss in,and Thorn has failed with those circumstances. So lets keep him, under those circumstances, and things will improve. For no other reason than he's got more time. :roll:



one thing is certain, if we don't give the man time we will never know. Not that I think Thorn is the greatest since old big head but sooner or later someone has to have time to build. Then again I heard Pep was seen in Tesco's at the Ricoh this morning :roll:


Another thing we know is certain. Thorn was in charge all this season with fuck all to play with and got relegated.

So next season with even less to play with and losing the most experienced members of his squad he'll obviously do better! How stupid of me :roll:
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Re: Southampton

Postby plastic scouser » Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:29 pm

FAO adge:

Jeffers, Clarke, Thomas, Willis & Cameron have all recently represented England at either U17, U18 or U19 level......

...just saying...
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Re: Southampton

Postby the boss » Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:31 pm

AD wrote:

So next season with even less to play with and losing the most experienced members of his squad he'll obviously do better! How stupid of me :roll:



OK, lets just have another resurrection of Jesus, maybe he could do the job. Lets sack Thorn bring in another give him 2 games and sack him if he fails to gain 6 points as as sure as night follows day he is hopeless as well. Sooner or later we will find the messiah of that I'm sure 8)
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Re: Southampton

Postby dog rout 21 » Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:36 pm

plastic scouser wrote:FAO adge:

Jeffers, Clarke, Thomas, Willis & Cameron have all recently represented England at either U17, U18 or U19 level......

...just saying...


If they're so good why aren't they playing for England senior squad and every game for Barca? Yehhhh, try and answer me that one scouse 8)
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Re: Southampton

Postby AD » Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:53 pm

the boss wrote:
AD wrote:

So next season with even less to play with and losing the most experienced members of his squad he'll obviously do better! How stupid of me :roll:



OK, lets just have another resurrection of Jesus, maybe he could do the job. Lets sack Thorn bring in another give him 2 games and sack him if he fails to gain 6 points as as sure as night follows day he is hopeless as well. Sooner or later we will find the messiah of that I'm sure 8)


As I already wrote:

I'm not a Mandaric type who would sack someone for losing two games on the trot or not getting to the play-offs. I'd be happy to settle for a few years mid-table as long as the building for the future could be seen, as Southampton showed with the likes of Bale, Walcott, Chamberlain and Lallana. But you have to put some emphasis on the here and now too, or all those long term plans can be ruined.


If Thorn can arrest the slide and stabilise us next year then good luck to him. However, I foresee another Strachan where that won't happen and we'll be sliding down L1.

What's the point of having a long-term plan to bring on youngsters or bring in talented younger players from elsewhere if the first team don't generate enough cash for you to afford the fees or the academy? It's already been mentioned in cost-cuttings measures twice by SISU before being persuaded otherwise.....
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Re: Southampton

Postby The Yid » Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:50 pm

AD wrote:
the boss wrote:
AD wrote:

So next season with even less to play with and losing the most experienced members of his squad he'll obviously do better! How stupid of me :roll:



OK, lets just have another resurrection of Jesus, maybe he could do the job. Lets sack Thorn bring in another give him 2 games and sack him if he fails to gain 6 points as as sure as night follows day he is hopeless as well. Sooner or later we will find the messiah of that I'm sure 8)


As I already wrote:

I'm not a Mandaric type who would sack someone for losing two games on the trot or not getting to the play-offs. I'd be happy to settle for a few years mid-table as long as the building for the future could be seen, as Southampton showed with the likes of Bale, Walcott, Chamberlain and Lallana. But you have to put some emphasis on the here and now too, or all those long term plans can be ruined.


If Thorn can arrest the slide and stabilise us next year then good luck to him. However, I foresee another Strachan where that won't happen and we'll be sliding down L1.

What's the point of having a long-term plan to bring on youngsters or bring in talented younger players from elsewhere if the first team don't generate enough cash for you to afford the fees or the academy? It's already been mentioned in cost-cuttings measures twice by SISU before being persuaded otherwise.....


So what exactly is your short term option then?? Sack Thorn - may more compensation, reduce the wage/transfer budget further??

Outside of 12-13,000 core fans we have a pitiful fan base - (out of a city of 350,000), who seem to think we have some god given right to be still in the Premier League, and that we should be acting in that way. We went for shit or bust, and got royally fucked over. At this point we should be grateful we still have a club, and that we have a succesful academy that will provide us with players in the future (even if adge thinks they are all useless)

Keep Thorn - he wants to be our manager, and not repeat the mistakes that we have for the last 10 years.
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